Update On poss new Variable

[dmill1220]

HI Folks
just to keep you updated on the situation,
I had also sent in inquiry to the IRSA and I finally got a response from their Scientist, here is the latest, its sounds promising but it wont come easy.




Summary: There seem to be a problem with a dss1r band 1956 image, it shows a star that does not appear in any other Dss 1956 image or ...



Change: Disposition: [Open - Not Reviewed] to [Need Customer Input]
1 name added to the notification list: Dennis Miller
**** Added Comment dated 02/16/07 ****
Comment By: Davy Kirkpatrick
Date: 02/16/07
Notes: Dear Dennis:

I've looked at the (J2000) position you noted, and I see the object you mention. It doesn't look like any of the kinds of plate defects I've seen in the past, but it appears to be a bit elongated, not round. None of the other images in FinderChart, including the r and i images from SDSS that go deeper, show the object seen in the R-band DSS1 image.

One idea is that this is an asteroid whose position was streaked across the R-band DSS image during the course of the exposure. For the other images, the asteroid was no longer in the field.

To do a bit more follow-up, I checked the dates and times of both DSS1 images (from the POSS-I survey) using the FITS headers. Both were taken on the same night but weren't simultaneous. These dates and times were --

B-band plate: 07 Apr 1956 at 10:25 (UT?), 8-min integration
R-band plate: 07 Apr 1956 at 09:42 (UT?), 45-min integration

It's unlikely that an asteroid of normal colors would be invisible in the B-band if it was still in the field. Given the short amount of time between the two plates and given the streak length in the 45-min exposure, the asteroid would easily have been in the field for the B-band exposure. Furthermore, the ecliptic latitude of this field (+50.9 degrees) means that the asteroid hypothesis is less likely. To make a long story short, this probably isn't an asteroid streak either. That's especially true if you saw this on your own image from a different epoch.

The most direct check is to have someone scrutinize the actual plate from which the R-band scan was taken. The plates, I believe, now live on Palomar Mountain. At last report Jean Mueller (jem@astro.caltech.edu) was the curator of these, so you might want to ask her.

Good luck!

---Davy Kirkpatrick, IRSA Project Scientist
Resulting State: <No State Change>
end message:

My next step is to contact Jean Meuller,
Iam stll waiting to hear from MR Zolt at the ESA,
I have got my fingers crossed!
Dennis

[ozzmoziz]

well thats a start man

[Dragon Star]

Good luck, let us know!

[dmill1220]

THe Suspense is Killing me!
LOL
Dennis

[dmill1220]

Hi Folks,
I have recieved an e-mail back from Jean Meuller at Mt Palomar, she asked if i had other images that show the star, I promptly sent her three with special notice on one attached,
She informed me that she will scrutinize the plates but this will take some time as they are in storage.
This Image attached has the star closer to my original image's star position
Dennis

[Darryl]

Originally Posted by dmill1220

Hi Folks,
I have recieved an e-mail back from Jean Meuller at Mt Palomar, she asked if i had other images that show the star, I promptly sent her three with special notice on one attached,
She informed me that she will scrutinize the plates but this will take some time as they are in storage.
This Image attached has the star closer to my original image's star position
Dennis

Hi Dennis,

Excellent!!! At least you know she is working on it. It's going to be more than interesting to see what she finds.

Regards,

[ozzmoziz]

hi Dennis i was messing around with deepsky and did an update and i get this pic that comes up
http://archive.stsci.edu/cgi-bin/dss...e&fov=NONE&v3=
it seems that pic as that var star in between the 2 stars.
not sure when the pic was taken , but its there

[dmill1220]

HI Ozz!
NIce Catch!, Now if we can only find out the date! it looks like a dss 1st generation shot, when you pull the image are you pulling it from your software ? if you can get a look at the fits header, it should show the date.
IM still waiting for MRS Meuller, as soon as she gets her new Microscopes, she has promised to analyze the plates, I do have evidence that rules out a plate defect. the wierd part is that I can show both star positions at different dates. not only on my image, but a 1996 blue band sdss image shows them both, with a little magnification and, a contrast adjust both are there!
Thanks Ozz I still need more evidence, keep them comming!
MRs Mueller at Palomar says it will take a while longer!

Dennis

[Darryl]

Hi,

I hate to burst bubbles, but I believe its the same one I posted earlier. http://www.extremeastronomy.com/foru...2&d=1171420365


Edit: I posted a link to the fits header information but it was the wrong one. I'll have to try and dig it up.

Edit: Here it is.

SIMPLE = T /FITS: Compliance
BITPIX = 16 /FITS: I*2 Data
NAXIS = 2 /FITS: 2-D Image Data
NAXIS1 = 530 /FITS: X Dimension
NAXIS2 = 530 /FITS: Y Dimension
EXTEND = T /FITS: File can contain extensions
DATE = '2007-02-25 ' /FITS: Creation Date
ORIGIN = 'STScI/MAST' /GSSS: STScI Digitized Sky Survey
SURVEY = 'POSSI-E ' /GSSS: Sky Survey
REGION = 'XE173 ' /GSSS: Region Name
PLATEID = '07VR ' /GSSS: Plate ID
SCANNUM = '00 ' /GSSS: Scan Number
DSCNDNUM = '00 ' /GSSS: Descendant Number
TELESCID = 1 /GSSS: Telescope ID
BANDPASS = 8 /GSSS: Bandpass Code
COPYRGHT = 'STScI/AURA' /GSSS: Copyright Holder
SITELAT = 33.356 /Observatory: Latitude
SITELONG = 116.863 /Observatory: Longitude
TELESCOP = 'Palomar Schmidt ' /Observatory: Telescope
INSTRUME = 'Photographic Plate' /Detector: Photographic Plate
EMULSION = '103aE ' /Detector: Emulsion
FILTER = 'plexi ' /Detector: Filter
PLTSCALE = 67.20 /Detector: Plate Scale arcsec per mm
PLTSIZEX = 355.000 /Detector: Plate X Dimension mm
PLTSIZEY = 355.000 /Detector: Plate Y Dimension mm
PLATERA = 205.486433490 /Observation: Field centre RA degrees
PLATEDEC = 47.2668629834 /Observation: Field centre Dec degrees
PLTLABEL = 'E1593 ' /Observation: Plate Label
DATE-OBS = '1956-04-07T09:42:00' /Observation: Date/Time
EXPOSURE = 45.0 /Observation: Exposure Minutes
PLTGRADE = '1 ' /Observation: Plate Grade
OBSHA = -1.06667 /Observation: Hour Angle
OBSZD = 18.4781 /Observation: Zenith Distance
AIRMASS = 1.05424 /Observation: Airmass
REFBETA = 61.8196598237 /Observation: Refraction Coeff
REFBETAP = -0.0820000000000 /Observation: Refraction Coeff
REFK1 = 68215.8095705 /Observation: Refraction Coeff
REFK2 = 0.000000000000 /Observation: Refraction Coeff
CNPIX1 = 10878 /Scan: X Corner
CNPIX2 = 6721 /Scan: Y Corner
XPIXELS = 14000 /Scan: X Dimension
YPIXELS = 13999 /Scan: Y Dimension
XPIXELSZ = 25.2845 /Scan: Pixel Size microns
YPIXELSZ = 25.2845 /Scan: Pixel Size microns
PPO1 = 0.000000000000 /Scan: Orientation Coeff
PPO2 = 0.000000000000 /Scan: Orientation Coeff
PPO3 = 177500.000000 /Scan: Orientation Coeff
PPO4 = 0.000000000000 /Scan: Orientation Coeff
PPO5 = 0.000000000000 /Scan: Orientation Coeff
PPO6 = 177500.000000 /Scan: Orientation Coeff
PLTRAH = 13 /Astrometry: Plate Centre H
PLTRAM = 41 /Astrometry: Plate Centre M
PLTRAS = 56.74 /Astrometry: Plate Centre S
PLTDECSN = '+ ' /Astrometry: Plate Centre +/-
PLTDECD = 47 /Astrometry: Plate Centre D
PLTDECM = 16 /Astrometry: Plate Centre M
PLTDECS = 0.7 /Astrometry: Plate Centre S
EQUINOX = 2000.0 /Astrometry: Equinox
AMDX1 = 67.2437009445 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX2 = -0.0602957919734 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX3 = -370.908804062 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX4 = -3.68942152514E-005 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX5 = -1.68468173561E-005 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX6 = -8.50256033768E-006 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX7 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX8 = 2.20659897644E-006 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX9 = -1.16387301663E-007 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX10 = 2.30267119823E-006 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX11 = -2.81466869455E-008 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX12 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX13 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX14 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX15 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX16 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX17 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX18 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX19 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDX20 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY1 = 67.2651239482 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY2 = 0.0527571479370 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY3 = -53.7552111660 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY4 = -2.27360610178E-005 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY5 = -2.17288479763E-005 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY6 = -3.64930998176E-006 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY7 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY8 = 1.85400409883E-006 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY9 = 3.50589681485E-008 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY10 = 2.09429280195E-006 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY11 = 5.69678023734E-009 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY12 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY13 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY14 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY15 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY16 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY17 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY18 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY19 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDY20 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC1 Coeff
AMDREX1 = 67.2474423538 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX2 = -0.0585866787040 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX3 = -372.263016481 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX4 = 8.66492987005E-006 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX5 = -5.41934888247E-006 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX6 = 4.34795509048E-006 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX7 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX8 = -2.85608632718E-007 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX9 = -4.67755442897E-008 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX10 = 3.50365289486E-008 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX11 = 2.15657773378E-008 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX12 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX13 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX14 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX15 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX16 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX17 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX18 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX19 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREX20 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY1 = 67.2624229023 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY2 = 0.0528514790746 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY3 = -52.1619080783 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY4 = -1.55762129885E-005 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY5 = -3.87295472950E-007 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY6 = 4.94192636498E-006 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY7 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY8 = -2.77865723316E-007 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY9 = 1.78234828514E-008 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY10 = -5.28663062770E-008 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY11 = 7.57692901348E-008 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY12 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY13 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY14 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY15 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY16 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY17 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY18 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY19 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
AMDREY20 = 0.000000000000 /Astrometry: GSC2 Coeff
ASTRMASK = 'xe.mask ' /Astrometry: GSC2 Mask
WCSAXES = 2 /GetImage: Number WCS axes
WCSNAME = 'DSS ' /GetImage: Local WCS approximation from full plat
RADESYS = 'ICRS ' /GetImage: GSC-II calibration using ICRS system
CTYPE1 = 'RA---TAN ' /GetImage: RA-Gnomic projection
CRPIX1 = 265.500000 /GetImage: X reference pixel
CRVAL1 = 202.467925 /GetImage: RA of reference pixel
CUNIT1 = 'deg ' /GetImage: degrees
CTYPE2 = 'DEC--TAN ' /GetImage: Dec-Gnomic projection
CRPIX2 = 265.500000 /GetImage: Y reference pixel
CRVAL2 = 47.195050 /GetImage: Dec of reference pixel
CUNIT2 = 'deg ' /Getimage: degrees
CD1_1 = -0.0004718685 /GetImage: rotation matrix coefficient
CD1_2 = -0.0000186432 /GetImage: rotation matrix coefficient
CD2_1 = -0.0000186723 /GetImage: rotation matrix coefficient
CD2_2 = 0.0004719270 /GetImage: rotation matrix coefficient
OBJECT = 'data ' /GetImage: Requested Object Name
DATAMIN = 2089 /GetImage: Minimum returned pixel value
DATAMAX = 14164 /GetImage: Maximum returned pixel value
OBJCTRA = '13 29 52.370 ' /GetImage: Requested Right Ascension (J2000)
OBJCTDEC = '+47 11 40.80 ' /GetImage: Requested Declination (J2000)
OBJCTX = 11143.57 /GetImage: Requested X on plate (pixels)
OBJCTY = 6986.10 /GetImage: Requested Y on plate (pixels)
INPUTFMT = 'FITS ' / Format of file from which image was read


Regards,

[dmill1220]

Hi Darryl,
I was afraid that was the case, I did'nt check out the link, but I was suspect of the Link, it includes the dss in the URL.
I do have three separate images that confirm both star positions, one is a 1996 B band Image that correlates to the 1956 r band image, it just needed a contrast and brightness adjustment on my Monitor.
another is a 1996 image from an Independant source, that shows the star in the position that my image shows.
I'm sure that as soon as Mrs.Meuller at MT. Palomar, gets her Microscopes she will shed some light on this, I have sent her the Images along with the links were they were found. she has answered back and is really interested.
even if I got nothing at all and its all one big coincidence, A dss survey plate defect will be annotated and corrected.
Dennis